Announcement

**Topfly** · 14-05-2009, 07:20 PM

Sorry for the big hit , just bringing to your attention that the so called conservationists are trying to get rid of the "socio economic" clause in the soon to be made Law, Coastal Bill. this includes recreational sea anglers.

**davem2005** · 15-05-2009, 08:41 AM

Its certainly the case that anglers want/need that phrase in there...or at least the socio part of it.

One of the hardest parts about the introduction of MCZ's as you will have gathered from Alans threads , is getting defra to define exactly what criteria will be used for the designation of a MCZ.

I think that only time will tell.

**seanyrooroo** · 15-05-2009, 10:50 AM

Anyone else want to jump on the bandwagon?

Socio - what??

**davem2005** · 15-05-2009, 11:07 AM

They have all been on the bandwagon from the very beginning.

The marine bill is a "once in a lifetime" change to the way seas are managed and it doesn't just affect anglers. Obviosly everyone wants their say and opinions dont often agree between groups who's interests are in conflict.

Unfortunately a lot of the groups expressing those views are highly funded, highly organised , very co-ordinated and very well supported in terms of membership. if only we could say the same for anglers.

The formation of the angling trust is an attempt to bring angling under one banner and thereby strengthen the case for anglers when it comes to having our say.

Just how succesful that will be remains to be seen.

Cheers
Dave.

**seanyrooroo** · 15-05-2009, 06:38 PM

Very true Dave, I'm a member of BASC and they are very organised and as such are heard when they speak. I don't think RSA's realise just how powerful a group we could be if we all stood side-by-side.

**Mike.Haley** · 16-05-2009, 02:23 PM

All anglers will have to realise we must stand together or kiss goodbye to our favorite pasttime, but the Angling Trust will have to show they have the sea anglers interests at heart. They did not do this by appointing a trout & salmon ( fresh water) fishing university graduate to look after the interests of the north east sea angler.

**Charlton** · 20-05-2009, 07:25 PM

very worrying that Topfly

**Topfly** · 20-05-2009, 10:40 PM

Alan, pity i cant attend the meeting at the ouseburn centre about the MCZs , i hope there is a good turn out to represent our angling clubs, and we get some coherent answers instead of the usual waffle. Is there any chance of getting a bit of media coverage for the meeting, or do you think that is over the top bearing in mind that we are not going to get many more chances of bringing this to the attention of the angling community. The majority of anglers are not members of clubs but are still passionate about the sport, and might not have the information that we have access to. just a thought...Jim

**davem2005** · 21-05-2009, 09:06 AM

Taken from a recent press release by the Angling Trust

Angling Trust announces new regional team to promote angling nationwide.

The Angling Trust has recently confirmed the appointment of six new Regional Officers to join the two already in place. Their remit will be to promote and develop angling across the country. Working within local communities, with schools, the Scouts and Angling Trust member clubs and fisheries they will be responsible for promoting the Trust and introducing angling to a new generation of young people.

These appointments are supported by Sport England and the Environment Agency and each of the new officers will concentrate on a specific region. Their work is a vital step for the Trust in its new role of promoting angling to a new audience.

Working with key partners, these regional officers will establish an infrastructure to develop the sport of angling within England. This includes working alongside national, regional and local angling and non-angling organisations to:

� develop regional angling development plans � provide local leadership � support the development of coaches � develop clubs and volunteers � establish regional development frameworks � establish a safe environment for young people to participate in angling � communicate the work of the Angling Trust across their region � Identify the issues affecting Angling Trust members in their region � Co-ordinate a showcase event as part of National Fishing Week

Mike. I assume you are refering to the appointment of Ben Thompson to cover angling development in the NE. I dont know what his past angling practice has been but the job entails promoting angling as a whole and not just specifically sea angling.

With regard to the NE RSA's we are probably in a better position in terms of representation at the moment than we have been for many years.

The angling trust has two sides, the region match side and the conservation side. The NE is chaired by Sam Harris and an active committee whilst there is also a Yorkshire division.

In addition there is a national conservation committee and then finally the Marine committee which is chaired by Stuart McPherson who himself is a NE angler.

Discussions on matters affecting anglers such as Art 47, Bait Digging and MCZ's are held by the conservation committee who then put this forward to the marine committe and then on to the AT board for ratification.

I am a member of the conservation committee which along with Stuart gives us two regional representatives on the ground level and Stuart then can take things right to the AT board.

The last meeting of the conservation Group was last saturday at Warwick and NE topics were firmly on the agenda. The main ones been Bait Digging and the Northumberland EMS which is destined to automatically become a MCZ. This is something we need to be aware of as this covers 115km of the coastline from Berwick southwards and so any legislation covering this area will have consequences on shore (and to a lesser degree boat) anglers.

Another topic of conversation was anglers who sit on the Sea Fisheries Committee's and it was agreed that better sharing of information and more help should be given to these people to ensure they can represent anglers better. In the NE we have two representatives on the Northumberland SFC who are Les Weller (Loopyles5 on here) and myself. There are also 4 reprentatives on the NE SFC.

In addition to this we have Alan who is also doing his bit to help NE sea anglers and seems to be getting good results from what I read.

One thing that was made clearer was the way in which MCZ's will be chosen based on the work already done in the SW region which is 2 years ahead of us in terms of creating MCZ's.

It starts with scientists Identifying how much (but not where ) needs MCZ status and for what reasons. This is then passed to a group drawn from all coastal users at the grass roots level. This group will include Commercials, Divers, dreders, bird watchers etc etc. In the SW it initially included 1 angler and a second has been included in recent months. There is hope to get a third angler on this committee as the area involved increases.

This group then discuss each area and decide where should be made into a MCZ and the reasons for its creation. This then goes back up the line to public consultation and finally designation as a MCZ. This is a total reversal of the normal practice where scientist deside where and then it moves straight to consultation and introduction.

The time scale for this to be in place is 2012, which considering the SW project has been running for 2 years already and they are only just collecting the data is in my view a very optomistic target.

It's very early days for the Angling Trust with a lot of new projects just beginning and the change from NFSA to AT has not been as easy as expected by all accounts.

One interesting fact is that on one of the earlier public consultations with Defra the only NE stakeholder was listed as NESA, and things have come a long way since then.

Cheers
Dave

**Mike.Haley** · 22-05-2009, 03:08 PM

Dave, I agree that angling needs developing in all area,s.
What i am questioning is why is the Angling Trust pushing so hard for MCZ,s when we have no proof that recreational angling has any impact on the environment? Can you or anyone else publish a figure of how many fish are on the sea bed in any given area?
Course, Trout and Salmon angling are Managed in the name of conservation by:

1) Rod licenses
2) Close seasons
3) Catch limits.
How long before we see these measures in place for sea angling in the name of conservation?
MCZ = Article 47 for shore anglers and that is why all anglers( boat and shore) must stick together or kiss goodbye to angling as we want it.
Try reading Steve Copollo's view of MCZ's in BFM.

**Topfly** · 23-05-2009, 10:14 PM

I agree Mike, We needed something from the ashes of the NFSA, and other organisations who were all pulling in different directions. If you are a member of a club anywhere in the country, and that club/ individual subscribes to the Angling Trust via membership fees , then you would come under the rules and regulations that they negotiate on your behalf, and you should have the right to contribute to the process of what is acceptable practice regarding Recreational Sea Angling. The anglers outside of the A.T. will mostly, carry on oblivious of the constraints imposed on them with MCZs . no take zones. etc . IMO the whole thing cannot work without a rod licence, and A.T. know that, but it will take time, and there will always be a lot more anglers that will fish without a licence, regardless of the consequences. I personally think the MCZs will cover such big stretches of coastline that the remaining areas of coast line, will be easily patrolled by whoever needs to control the anglers.

**davem2005** · 23-05-2009, 10:25 PM

Hi Mike,

MCZ's are coming wether we want them or not. They affect all sea users not just anglers.

I dont believe the Angling Trust are pushing for MCZ's but since they are inevitable it makes sense to be involved with the discussions from the very start and thereby get some input into what they are and where and more importantly try to ensure they have a positive impact on our fishing rather than restricting it.

We could sit back and do nothing and then the dozens of organisations who want MCZ's would have a free run to set the rules.

There is very little data on inshore stocks because traditionally the only areas studied have been the offshore fishing grounds which have a commercial interest. Anglers have been saying for years we have no impact on stocks but what we dont have are the figures to prove it. Hence Defra asking for data on anglers activities, but a disagreement in the way the data is to be collected and its ultimate use.

As for the imposition of licenses/close season and bag limits, I would not agree any of these would be good for RSA's but there are some very succesfull fisheries in other countries that have these...we can only wait and see what happens.

One thing I dont understand is why anglers seem to have accepted the new wording of article 47. As I understand it all boat anglers are going to have serious restrictions imposed by the EU which are totally unworkable and will crucify our regions summer fishing. Our traditional summer cod fishing is targeting a species subject to a recovery plan and therefore as a region we would still fall under the heading as a group who would be subject to the EU restrictions. Its time NE anglers woke up to this , and we will have to see whats said at the June meetings on this.

The minutes of the conservation group meeting are pblished on Tuesday so will try to get them on here on Weds.

Cheers
Dave

**Topfly** · 23-05-2009, 10:30 PM

Nice one Dave, we can only push for the best possible outcome for anglers.

**davem2005** · 23-05-2009, 11:35 PM

Originally posted by Topfly View Post

I personally think the MCZs will cover such big stretches of coastline that the remaining areas of coast line, will be easily patrolled by whoever needs to control the anglers.

It certainly looks like we will be getting a very big MCZ in terms of the coastline length in Northumberland, but please dont believe that because its a MCZ it means no fishing.

The designation of a MCZ is basically to protect individual features of each area that it recieved its designation for in the first place. Different features need different control measures to protect them. Sea Angling is widely recognised as been sustainable and causing minimal damage to the enviroment so it is unlikely to be restricted in many areas.

The likely knock on effect is that if trawling and dredging (which are recognised as damaging to the environment) are banned in a particular area this will have major benefits to sea anglers in a region.

Another point that is widely agreed on ( particularly by the sfc protection officers ) is that it would be an impossible task to police a licensing scheme which is why it was dropped from the Marine Bill right at the start.

Then along comes a EU proposal to introduce such a scheme that includes licensing, which gets half dropped. But it still leaves us with a potential for boats needing to be registered and report catches within half an hour of landing. Satelitte tracking on larger vessels (yes mr charter skipper that means you). And quotas for all cod catches from boats! Workable? I think not.

Cheers
dave

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