boundaries N v S

[gazzawill]

iff a pier is closed due to weather or other circumstances it should be common scence not to go on or fish it
i like the idea of our beaches being included also (south side im from seaham) and iff foss is right about the boundries
i remember last year this comp was going to be called off from the sea state but was mentiond to fish the tyne esturie so why not ours(the wear)
just my oppinion

 

[YoursTruly]

TC, yes it does apply to the S/S Open and thats why every year the Port of Tyne Authority decide not to open the pier we have loads of hassle from anglers when we tell them they cannot go round the gates as our public liability insurance would be null and void.

The cliff tops as i mentioned above is purely adivising you of the dangers, and it is down to your own choice.

 

[T.C.]

We've had this subject come up previously, Terry - access to the pier when the gate's closed.
I actually went down (purposely) to have a look at the notices on the gate.......there is NOTHING saying it is "illegal", "tresspassing" or even "dangerous" to go beyoned the gate when it's closed.......there isn't even anything saying "at own risk". All in all, there's nothing saying NOT to go beyoned the gate (other than the gate being closed, that is).

However....a sign may have been erected since last year ?????

If not.....you're dead right - there IS difference - the signs on the clifftop - not to mention the presence of the barrier rail are there to warn people off from going beyond the barrier.

 

[YoursTruly]

There is a notice at the start of the pier and if i am not mistaken at the first gate ( which TC you must be aware of) telling you it is prohibited to go round the gates.

Are you 100% sure about that Terry.

Jim.

Jim, i will make a point of going to the pier tommorrow and take another look just to make sure and i will post my findings.


If it was not an offence to round the gates when closed then why do the police on occasions go to the end at night and chase anglers off.

 

[T.C.]

"The cliff tops as i mentioned above is purely adivising you of the dangers, and it is down to your own choice."

Maybe so, Terry - but I know the National Trust aren't too happy about people going beyoned the barrier for a fishing comp.

 

[willywetegg]

Unfortunately I have to be up very early this morning as I would have loved to have taken this conversation a stage further.

I promise i will be down to read the signs on South Shields pier before this weekend and will report my findings on this thread,

Jim.

 

[YoursTruly]

TC, you dead right they do not like it and if it were illegal then i am sure they would have found some loophole to stop fishing altogether.

As i have already stated, the police do make checks on the pier when the gates are closed and usually give any angler caught a caution, if it was not an offence then the anglers would not be cautuioned.

Now i would be very surprised if you had not heard of that .

 

[T.C.]

If I remember rightly (and I'm not saying that I do, mind...lol)....I'm sure it was when it was last mentioned on here about anglers being "cautioned" by the police for being beyoned the gate when it was locked. That is what prompted me to go and have a look to see just what notices were actually on the gate....and like I said....there was nothing to say you'd be in breach of anything , either in Law or Bye-Law. Bt that was THEN......as I said before, something to that effect may have been erected since last year.

 

[gazzawill]

im a member of seaham sea angling club and our north peir is gated off the members get a key each year on renewal of subs
but its the prperty of the dock company i suppose its up to them to police the area .part of the membership is iff asked produce your member ship pass and key and if the gates are chaind shut its for your own safty / any member found fishing beyond these gates while chaind will loose membership and be declined member ship in the future

 

[gazzawill]

iff the boundries for this comp say went to horden whats stoping me from fishing my local peir as im a member ?????? another view into it

 

[simon-ayre]

why not just say no fishing beond any barrier or shut gate (peirs are in if open) and boundries are from south of the tyne to north of the wear inclusive.
This gives everyone a chance to fish safely regardless of bad weather ,age, disability,or lack of knowledge of the area.
When all said and done this get together is to promote our great sport and for people to meet and begin frenships.
And as long as the south are triumphant nothing else matters

 

[YoursTruly]

Well i have been down to both piers (Roker and S/S) and looked at the notices displayed.
Although there was no dispute about Roker i thought it best to have alook anyway.

Roker: It states quite clearly that you are not allowed beyond the gates when closed.

S/S: The old notices have been taken down by the Port of Tyne and more modern up to date signage has been put in its place.
The first notice as you about to walk onto the pier, just past the Brigade Hut reads:
INJURY or DAMAGE TO PERSONS OR PROPERTY
This property is PRIVATE. Any Unauthorised person passing this notice does so at their own risk and the Authority shall not be responsible for any Injury or Damage or loss caused, to such persons or property however or whenever such injury or loss may be caused.

There were a few notices on the first gates, only one is relavent and it read as follows:

WARNING
During Bad weather this pier is dangerous.
These gates are locked for the protection of the public.


The above notices are totally different to the old ones. To some it would look as though it would be ok to cross the gates.

I have spoken to someone (off the record) who works at the PTA and it seems these notices were put up as a result of the risk assessment made of the pier.
It has put measures in place so as to cover their backs in case of an accident, if you understand Risk Assessments then this would make sense.
TC, i am pretty sure you would be aware of Risk Assessments and measures taken to reduce the dangers.

I do not want to contact the Authorities Officially as it may open up a whole can of worms.

Jim, i have time to think about something you implied last night, suggesting that i wanted the pier closed to make it difficult for the north side, well let me just say, no way would i want to make things difficult for the north side that is why i suggested the rivers Tyne & Wear were included along with Durham Beaches.

 

[andysc]

can you fish the pier or not !

 

[STEVO]

Not if its closed which its likely to be..

 

[Davey.adair]

If it's a South of the Tyne match, why can't it be fished anywhere which is not closed, or prohibited.

Last year our kid and me were thinking of craster, as there were no boundaries but thought it a bit to far to travel, decided on Blyth pier instead, however, if people want to travel further a field, why not let them, after all they have the same time allocated as everyone else, and therefore, it has to be there choice whether to use it for fishing or travelling.

 

[STEVO]

Cause theyre the rules lol ..Jim is running it this year the boundries are set and it will be the same next year ..there will be boundries set .. gonna make it harder again for us northerners with you lot knowing your stuff over there but we love the challenge and humiliation lol

 

[T.C.]

Andy,
as the rules stand (and rules are rules...lol) South Shields pier is out of bounds for the NvS Comp. if (and they will be) the gates are closed.

It's a shame this debate is going on on a thread about the NvS Comp....it's supposed to be a fun, light-hearted affair with the intention of creating a bit friendly rivalry, both on the Board and during the comp itself........however in reply to Terry.......

The signs on the gate stating,

" WARNING During Bad weather this pier is dangerous.
These gates are locked for the protection of the public."

may well be new signs.....but the wording is the same as the signs I seen last year when I went down to have a look for prohibition of access notices on the gate.........
There are no prohibition of access notices - there are no notices saying it is illegal to go beyoned the gate when it's closed, there are no notices saying you'd be tresspassing if you went beyoned the gate when it's closed and there is no sign saying that you'd be in contravention of any Bye-Law by going beyoned the gate when it's closed.

The National Trust signs (and barrier rails) erected along the whole stretch of cliff top from Shields to Seaburn carry a similar warning......
"WARNING it is dangerous to cross the barrier"

I agree with what you said about the barrier rails on the cliff-tops:
"The cliff tops as i mentioned above is purely adivising you of the dangers, and it is down to your own choice."
so too, then is the sign on the gate of the pier, in that case.

So if the organisers of the Shields Open allow competitors to contravene the safety barriers and notices along the cliff-tops (notices which were erected following continuous Risk Assessment by the National Trust), why do they say that the pier is out of bounds........aren't they contravening similar safety issues by allowing people to fish the cliffs??

Don't get me wrong - I'm not condoning the climbing around the gate on the pier - just as I'm not condoning going beyoned the cliff-top rail - nor am I (and nor are either of the signs) stating that you are forbidden to do so........all I am saying, like you, is that's it's a matter of "your own choice" to do so, or not.

 

[marksworld]

It's a shame this debate is going on on a thread about the NvS Comp....it's supposed to be a fun, light-hearted affair with the intention of creating a bit friendly rivalry, both on the Board and during the comp itself
QUOTE]

good point tony, the banter is fun but it wasn't like this last year. boundries are boundries. none of us moan when we fish other comps( well not much anyway). i dont know south of the river much but i will fish within the rules that are set. this comp is a light hearted affair, no money just fun even though i wouldn't mind whipping the south sides ass lol. ENJOY IT and just fish where ever you can


cheers
mark

 

[RobAdair]

If its of any help to the north lads who are struggling to find a safe venue, here are a few within the boundaries:

The Groyne at South Shields
Littlehaven Beach
South Shields Pier (up to the 1st gate!)
Sandhaven Beach
Grahams Sands
Marsden Beach
Seaburn Beach
Roker Promenade
Roker Beach

Bit pointless fishing the cliff tops in a low water comp (0.5m so the tide will be right out) so no worries about people crossing any barriers either.

Good Luck!

 

[STEVO]

Cheers rob very much appreciated mate.