Licenses

I've been a Sea Angler for well over 40 years.
In all that time I've always followed the rules of conservation and common sense. Never took home more fish than I needed, never knowingly killed or damaged undersized fish and never left any rubbish behind etc etc etc
I am not being dictated to by fools who don't have the foggiest idea about how one Shore Angler like myself can impact on Fish stocks whilst they continue to support the mass slaughter and dumping of Millions of Tons of white fish by the Commercials.

I will never buy a licence and be a party to this disgrace. They can go and stick their heads right up beside their own anal fins.

Protest Protest And Keep Protesting
 
And me...agree with what you say.

Particularly about the the protest bit, but protest to the right people.

When Sea anglers first started to lobby the government about a better deal for their chosen sport the consultation document went out to all people defra had logged down in their records as people to be consulted regarding fish stocks...the numbers were very few.

Then SOS proposed protection for Tope...the number of intrested parties and consultees had trebled as Defra realised just how many of us there were.

And this lastest document has gone out to even more people.

The list is here for those who want to see how many.

Defra, UK - Consultations - Consultation on a Recreational Sea Angling Strategy for England

Tonight I went to Boulmer beach to meet a couple of people from here who were fishing a match and learn a bit more about match fishing. It was pointed out to me that the consultation list does not include any names north of Whitby ( this may be wrong as I may have missed some as I dont know the name of every club in the NE ).

Is this because we dont care?

All it takes is a letter or email to defra ...or a reply to a previous consultation ...to get on that list. At least that way they know we exist and dont like whats going on.

If every club in the ne sent an email along the lines of

"We are xxxxxx sea angling club who have ?? members.

We would like to be included as stakeholders in any future consultations."

You could go on to include the club members thoughts on licenses etc ;)

Send it to

Nicola Clarke
Defra
Area 2C
Nobel House
17 Smith Square
London, SW1P 3JR

Email: [email protected]

Takes a few minutes...makes you and your members officially exist...and lets them know what you think.

Cheers
Dave
 
OK

Have done a bit of "laymans" maths

As of 1994, at the last official survey (source SACN), there were 1.1 million Recreational Sea Anglers in the UK

Conservatively round that up to 1.5 million in todays money and then multiply by £11 (which is the figure of estimated cost that seems to getting bandied around)

Total revenue from Sea License per annum - £16.5 million :o

More than plenty to cover admin' costs and certainly more than enough to provide adequate policing/baliffs

The coastal length of mainland Great Britain is approx 11072 miles.

At a mere cost of £3 million (that's not taking into account what the government would take back in income tax either) you could employ at least 150 of these baliffs (on 20k a year) to patrol just 74 miles of coastline each.

Leaving £13.5 million to cover "admin"

In theory, and assuming the money is pumped straight back into the system, there is no reason why a sea Angling license can't work given the right amount of assurances regarding investement into the infrastructure.
 
The Great Wallsendo said:
OK

At a mere cost of £3 million (that's not taking into account what the government would take back in income tax either) you could employ at least 150 of these baliffs (on 20k a year) to patrol just 74 miles of coastline each.
Click to expand...

in theory yes... if said baliffs were to walk the 74 miles on foot every day!

they'd be given a 4x4 no doubt, which would then be equipped with radio etc, uniforms etc etc, fuel costs, and so

then the 150 baliffs would need back office support, premises, admin staff, prosecution costs, training.

not trying to **** on anyone's bonfire here, just looking at it with my business head on

you'll not find many businesses, with 150 'ex works/travelling' staff and probably 30 or 40 office staff, that doesn't have running costs well into the millions
 
Last edited:
mark said:
in theory yes... if said baliffs were to walk the 74 miles on foot every day!

they'd be given a 4x4 no doubt, which would then be equipped with radio etc, uniforms etc etc, fuel costs, and so

then the 150 baliffs would need back office support, premises, admin staff, prosecution costs, training.

not trying to **** on anyone's bonfire here, just looking at it with my business head on

you'll not find many businesses, with 150 'shop floor' staff and probably 30 or 40 office staff, that doesn't have running costs well into the millions
Click to expand...

Especially if they sit browsing the net all day when they should be working :eek::rolleyes::D
 
;)

like I said...it was laymans maths LOL...passed my lunch hour quite nicely too :)

According to earlier posts it has been alleged that the cost of the license alone would only just cover admin' costs...

even if you were to include vehicles, training, cost of running, support staff etc £16.5 million could easily cover it
 
The Great Wallsendo said:
;)

like I said...it was laymans maths LOL...passed my lunch hour quite nicely too :)

According to earlier posts it has been alleged that the cost of the license alone would only just cover admin' costs...

even if you were to include vehicles, training, cost of running, support staff etc £16.5 million could easily cover it
Click to expand...

don't forget this is the civil service we are talking about - so anything that you'd cost in the real world will be doubled for the governmental gravy train

company I do bits n bobs for supply PC's to DWP and DEFRA, basic PC... £1200 each :o If they want the PC's supplying without a cd drive they charge the civil service an extra £150 - thats £150 quid extra for getting less equipment

they are supplied bare with no OS, cost to dump NT/win2000 or xp on em before delivery... another £85 plus the os licence so on average, a run of the mill donkey beige box PC is setting the tax payer back the stiff end of 2 grand

All the approved suppliers for civil service contracts know the score and its the same with everything from paper clips upwards

I've lost civil service contracts because I've not quoted high enough

completely Off Topic, but just an indictment of how, if they do rake in 16.5 million it will be quickly squandered

add in to the mix the amount they will pay for 'marketing' & advertising, brochure/leaflet production, some poncey bunch of marketing analysts to put some 'focus groups' together first, an IT company to write a database system for recording all the licences (that'll be 2 million) then another IT company to write another database system when the first is found 'not fit for purpose' etc etc

and your 16.5 million will disappear very quickly, and you won't get 150 baliffs for your money, you'll be lucky to see 30 nationwide.
 
The Great Wallsendo said:
they could always 3rd party it...lets get the Tories back in and then they'll privatise it all LOL :o
Click to expand...

you think it isn't already???

you be more than a little scared if you knew just how much of the civil service is now handled by private companies

and all done in the last 10 years
 
The Great Wallsendo said:
makes you wonder what your vote is worth these days...:(

If you look at it another way - is 1.5 million votes enough to sway a government:question:
Click to expand...

nope

cos out of the 1.5 million voters, there will be a huge number of labour voters who'll still vote for them anyway

if voting changed anything it would be outlawed, to quote winston churchill "democracy by the ballot box is the least worst alternative"

1.5 million voters with guns might do it - for a short while though
 
Mark ...Tony...the real figures...

Yeah they may need a new version of xp....or heaven forbid even could run to the vista upgrade...

But lets assume they have some money left after the projected extra expenses of enforcing a license...

From memory the forecast that the nesfc did on enforcement costs put their existig costs up by 1.1 million quid. That by the way did not include the cost of a new enforcement vessel and crew.

There are 13 sfc's in the uk...for now...

So lets assume that the nesfc underestimated the costs ...it has been known to happen that government projects run over budget ;) so 1.2 million times 13 sfc's = 14.6 milllion. Lets assume that half those sfc's considered a new patrol boat was essential...and the other half just settled for trebling the number of enforcement officers...so perhaps another 6 million spent on boats. We are now over 20 million ...

Which funnily enough the nesfc could not find a suitable supplier for here in the uk and had to order one from abroad to meet their needs last year.

Hey and dont forget they need a vista upgrade as well :D

Cheers
Dave
 
Dave....Had a thought yesterday after speaking to you re: two pleasure cruisers (lol) and bait digging.
Most anglers seem to be either blissfully unaware or apathetic to how things are going to affect us all over the coming years me probably as much as anyone.
Could you give us the full facts that can be digested by the average Geordie as to what benefits a licence will bring or how it will be detrimental, who we should contact/lobby to report misdemeanours by both commercial vessels and anglers who stand and continually catch and keep undersize fish or take undersize shellfish from our coasts. Who represents us as anglers and what they plan to do to ensure we as anglers have a voice. What legislation there is on trawling and netting? Which forms of commercial fishing are most damaging, quotas and who's taking the most. (It will clear up wether it's Russian factory ships, French Trawlers or our mates that we share a pint with in the local pub!)
Obviously we discussed the fact that our SFC is pretty toothless and hard to contact for the average guy, but is that because over the years anglers have just sat back and let things happen without speaking up rather than mumbling and groaning away on forums about the lack of fish and anti-social behaviour. How many people know about what you mentioned about the bait collecting from our shores. It was certainly news to me.
I t may be a monumental task, but it would in my opinion clear up a lot of myths and give anglers the knowledge they need to lobby the correct people in an informed manner.

BTW met Loopy for a couple of chucks and although we caught nowt (well he had a rockling) we had a good chat and put plans in place to go out again.
 

Similar threads

G
Sea Angling Strategy Draft 4
Replies
0
Views
1K
Glenn Kilpatrick
G
I
Scottish RSA is now relevant
Replies
2
Views
1K
Oblickta
Oblickta
Back
Top